"Quartier Libre" - Radio France Internationale Interview
with
Empress Farah Pahlavi
November 1997

RFI:
Madam, your life begins like fairy tale. Once upon a time there was an adolescent from a good Persian bourgeois family, cherished by a father who disappeared too soon and loved by a mother who was steeped in tradition but also open-minded. At that time, for a young girl to obtain a family's green light to study architecture was not something commonplace. Your choice and your wish to go to Paris and study in order to obtain your diploma will be respected. We find you during October 1957 at the University center of the boulevard Jourdan.

Your were serious, assiduous but destiny will decide otherwise. Everything tumbles down for you after an encounter in the French capital with Mohammad Reza, the Shah of Iran, during a reception at the embassy of your country. You will see him again in Teheran, and this will be the beginning of a love never disavowed. You interrupt your studies and on December 21, 1959 you become third wife of King Mohammad Reza. A year later, it is the birth of Reza, your elder son, the so much awaited for Crown Prince. You will have three more children, another boy and two girls. Anyway, the year 1959 signals a complete change in your life.

You become the First Lady of Iran with all the weight attached to this designation. The little Parisian student is propelled to another world and into an existence where constraints intensify. In addition Madam, your character I believe, leads to you many initiatives and you will head more than 36 foundations and associations in favour of children, women, schools, arts and culture. In 1967, there is another decisive stage, you become the First Empress of the country. The country that you and your husband wished to take out of under-development with the famed White Revolution, both economic and social initiated in 1963.

But history with great "H" was waiting for your at the corner, if I may express myself like that. In 1979 the heightening of tension reaches its climax. An Islamic wave engulfs the country and on January 16, 1979 you take the road to exile in the direction of Cairo. Cairo where a year later your husband will die from the aftermath of a cancer. Then madam, before going down the thread of your existence, if you have an image which one will you choose to describe exile? What is exile for you?

Farah Palavi:
Exile? you have the feeling to be on a raft, on an ocean with no port of call, you are without roots to keep you attached to the ground. Exile It is to be away from everything that is familiar, everything that touches your senses. You know, it is what you feel by smelling, what you see, what you hear, what you touch. All of this becomes different. It is a combination of things which makes you accustomed to this or that place or to this or that country of the world. It is all of that which is missing. A very sad and disagreeable feeling of no longer belonging anywhere. One can sense that only if one is in exile. While in Iran we read about people who were in exile, we saw persons who were exiled and came to us. But you cannot really feel it unless one is in exile.

RFI:
Has exile operated a drastic sorting of your knowledge, of your friends? Or those you supposed at the time to be your friends?

Farah Pahlavi:
Yes, it is a sad, bitter human experience that no one would like to experiment, although one learns in books that it has always been like that. When you are no longer in power, people around you do change.

RFI:
Is this change very brutal?

Farah Pahlavi:
Some changes are rather brutal, others happen little by little, but we do accept it, for this is as we are made, it is to be a human being. But on the other hand, we encounter so many people, and feel their affection, their sympathy, their fidelity, their loyalty. -- We discover amity we never surmised or profound friendships which did exist and continue despite your lot or despite what I may call a failure. These very important human values encourage you, they keep you alive, they make you maintain your hope in humanity.

RFI:
A moment ago you cited the word bitterness. On a daily basis, what do you do in order to avoid surrender to bitterness?

Farah Pahlavi:
You know, fortunately human nature is made in such a way that inner resources exist that we never suspected. There are things that happen in you inner self which surge out at the most difficult moments in order to help you. Is it a desire for survival? Is it because you say to yourself that you must keep your human dignity? - Well, it is what I did for my own dignity, for my husband while he was alive, for my children and for all those who believe in me and also for the sake of life itself. One must fight, one must keep hope, and one must take advantage from all that life can offer, such as peacefulness and hope.
In our culture poetry is very important, in our poetry in our poems all of life situations are explained. There is an answer to everything and one is under the impression that our poets have understood everything, saw everything and that they live today, even though they a thousand years ago. Their poems have helped me, their words have helped me, hope has helped, nature has helped me, friendship has helped me, all that is beautiful has helped. God knows how many beautiful things there are. Anyway I have accepted the fact that life cannot be without problems, problems at every level. Of course everything is relative, but if you are a human being, you must fight.

Music, then Part 2

RFI:
Has the circle of European crowned heads changed much around you or not?

Farah Pahlavi:
Well things somehow dwindle with the passage of years. I must confess that when we left Iran, the circle was very small but among the crowned heads many stayed in touch with us without being able to do anything, let us say politically, since their position did not allow it. Among all of that I must truly speak of President Sadat. The gratitude of my family and myself will remain eternal for President Sadat, the Egyptian people and Mrs. Sadat for their generous gesture in a very difficult period of the life of my husband. They were the only ones, and I believe that ( President Sadat ) with his human, friendly and fraternal gesture he bailed out many people.

RFI:
What do you regret most of your life as a Queen  first then an Empress, the life of court?

Farah Pahlavi:
It is not court life which I miss, this part of protocol, of the position. What I miss most certainly is the country itself. Nevertheless the possibility I had at the time to realized so many beautiful dreams. The progress of Iran, all of the projects we made with the millions of Iranian men and women who helped and cooperated in the country to reach development which had in 1979. When I recall my childhood when we did not have drinking water, when we did not vaccines for children. Then in a period 20 years later we had the great satisfaction, the joy to see all of our projects being realized. Now when we see and compare what is happening, specially for women, for the youth and for children, ... it is extremely sad.

I must confess that I do not miss at all the court side you spoke. Of course, people from outside see palaces, tiaras, cars, beautiful dresses but can seldom feel the weight of solitude, duty and responsibilities which we bear.

RFI:
In retrospect, do you think that when you were in Iran you were cut off from a certain reality?

Farah Pahlavi:
Personally I do not think so, - not much. Anyway when you are in power, be it in a monarchy, a republic or in any position, people around you try to cut you off from others. I had contacts with many of my compatriots, in numerous domains, social classes etc. What remains a joy for me is that I travelled a lot in Iran be it in regard to foundations or associations as you say and also because I wanted to know my country and be on the spot to see our accomplishments. I desired to witness our achievements and also get informed on what is missing in order to help within the position I had.

RFI:
Have you seen the revolution coming?

Farah Pahlavi:
The revolution NO, because nobody saw it coming. Certainly, there are a lot of people in Iran and abroad who now say yes of course, we saw it coming, we felt it. Nobody felt it, although we perceived discontentment, we sensed that there is like a malaise dating from almost a year or two ago. We felt pressure coming from abroad, . Pressure from the public opinion, from the media, yes this this we felt. And when demonstrations began, we never thought it would end the way it did. As things deteriorated, it was very difficult I think to control events. Unfortunately, we had the impression there existed some sort of collective hysteria. All who were, for a reason or another against my husband or the regime had for years for years done their underground work. Different groups, be it the religious, be other political groups that were in opposition. Also one must not forget the intrigues of certain external interests. Maybe we had become too powerful.

Unfortunately petroleum has always been for us a malediction and also our joy. It was the only product which could take us out from under-development and allow us on the road to progress. I am sure that many interests did not appreciate the price of oil which had gone so high. There were intrigues.

RFI:
In retrospect, can you analyze missed opportunities with the Iranian people?

Farah Pahlavi:
Well, there definitely errors which were committed otherwise we would not be here. It is something shared by many because if we want to use the word "IF," then we need many if's. The ifs of people who were in the government, the ifs of the people, the ifs of our intellectuals, the ifs from  those who from abroad influenced this movement.  But I think that should we have had a little more time, let us say one or two more years, things would not have reached such an outcome.  There would have been changes in the Iranian society. But as of 1974,  maybe certain matters should have been modified, a more open political society which was the aspiration of my husband.

He always said that his son would reign differently than him. If he reigned as he did, it is due to the geopolitical situation of Iran, because of external pressures on Iran. We were in a key period, a period where the country was coming out of ancestral time, that is to say from under-development towards development. These are always very dangerous stages.   I think that unfortunately, many people who should have been on the contrary for this movement, for a reason or another failed to understand it. Already, a few months after the revolution, those who helped the actual regime come to power, felt that it was an error and that they had been grossly mistaken.

Interval - Music part 3

RFI:
Coming back to you, you are a modern woman open to new ideas, you like modern art, abstract art etc., do you think that in a society as conservative as Iran, you that you have at times shocked a part of Iranian public opinion? I think notably of the clerics, and of all the work you did with women?

Farah Pahlavi:
You know, we were a generation, I mean my own which I call the Pahlavi generation, where men and women had the right to be educated, had the right to participate in sports, to go out, to shed backwardness, to participate in the life of our country within the framework of our traditions -- but with an open mind toward progress and the world at large. In Iran, I did not feel that I did things which have shocked the clergy. Anyway, the idea was not to only please them. During these past 18 years, they have demonstrated what they wanted. If they claim that it should be like that, that does not mean that the people should follow them. The best proof today resides in the latest elections. The majority which voted for a relative change were mostly women and the youth. They voted distinctively against the existing system. The clergy had brought down the age of voting to fifteen, thinking that the brainwashed youth would remain completely loyal. It is exactly the opposite that happened.

Anyway, the programs that were enacted in Iran had to be achieved. A country is condemned to follow the way to progress. We could not remain in a feudal system because it was agreeable to certain clerics. We could not let women remain as second class citizens, without the right to vote, without the right to work, without the right to be elected because certain clerics wanted it to be that way. And the most important matter is that although Iranian women suffer a lot and were terribly humiliated during these past years and continue to be so the government was unable to take back they rights. This means that Iranian women still vote, are still elected and still participate. Of course, there are many things that have changed, many laws like polygamy, divorce or the keeping of children or access to such and such a position like judge, because these gentlemen do not think that women are intelligent and just enough to be a judge and that the testimony of two women is equal to the testimony of one man. Yes these have changed -- but they were unable to cancel the participation of women to the life of the country.

RFI:
Madam it mus be very exceptional to educate children in exile with the idea of a return to power.

Farah Pahlavi:
It is very difficult as it is difficult with all young exiles, for on the one hand one wants to keep the culture of the country and on the other hand, children who are dispersed all over the world must integrate in the new societies. It is difficult for them because they are torn between the two, the culture of their country and the culture of the country they live in. Certainly where my children are concerned it has been very difficult. They had to go through periods that were very very difficult, specially at the beginning of exile when we were obliged to go from one corner of the world to the other. For the youth it is very difficult to understand certain political aspects of life and history. But fortunately and thank God they have kept their courage.

RFI:
Do you continue to entertain in your son the Crown Prince the idea that he can return to the throne?

Farah Pahlavi:
He does not need me for that. He has courage, he fights with abnegation and intelligence with many other Iranians, with the hope that one day, freedom will return to Iran. Iran is a country where everything was possible due to the culture it had, to the history it had, the civilization it had, really a beautiful country which was one of the cradle of civilization. It is a country which has human resources, natural resources. We had a period when everything was possible, we were going forward but unfortunately when the fruits of the tree were ripening, the tree was cut off. You know, my dream and my hope is that Iran rises again from its ashes. That Iran becomes a free country, a country which should have an honored place in the family of nations. And  should I have the one day again the chance to see my country, evidently, it will be a most beautiful day in my life.

THE END
Music

It was exiled Empress Farah Pahlavi
A realization of Darya Kianpour
Mixing: Joël Pochon
Talk and presentation: Carmen Bader

"Quartier Libre"
Service Magazine de Radio France Internationale

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